Modulate something with envelope

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ballacr75
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Modulate something with envelope

Post by ballacr75 » Wed Aug 17, 2016 4:48 pm

Hi, it is possible to modulate something with an envelope (that retrig with new notes)
eg. I want to modulate the amplitude of an amplifier connected into a modulator for simulate the fm amount decay
thanks
Emanuele

Koekepan
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Re: Modulate something with envelope

Post by Koekepan » Wed Aug 17, 2016 7:57 pm

Sure, here's how:

Set up your patch how you want it. Let's assume for the moment that it's a MultiSynth leading to a couple of Generator modules that you're using for FM. Ultimately, with whatever filters or effects you want to use, they lead to Output.

Now we add the envelope. First add an additional MultiSynth. That MultiSynth leads to the MultiSynth at the start of the patch you want to modulate, but it also leads to a set of Generator modules that, in aggregate, produce the kind of complex envelope you want (including LFOs, slow attacks, fast attacks, decays, whatever makes you happy). All these Generators (plus LFOs and effects) lead to a Sound2Ctrl module that then modulates whatever parameter you wanted to modulate in the first place. Set all the Generators you use in this envelope to polyphony 1, so that you don't get multiple envelopes running over each other.

This way you can create an arbitrarily complex envelope, and it will retrigger every time you hit a new note.

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ballacr75
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Re: Modulate something with envelope

Post by ballacr75 » Thu Aug 18, 2016 12:26 am

Ok, thanks, I've understood the Sound2Ctrl (it's an envelope follower), but when I connect to the amplifier of the modulator I hear a noise, also trying to modify the sample rate and smooth doesn't remove this noise!

Koekepan
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Re: Modulate something with envelope

Post by Koekepan » Thu Aug 18, 2016 3:58 am

Sounds like a possible bug.

Copy up your .sunvox file, and we can have a look and try to sort it out? Or NightRadio can use it for debugging purposes.

init8orbit
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Re: Modulate something with envelope

Post by init8orbit » Thu Aug 18, 2016 10:22 am

Hi,

is it possible to control midi parameters (to midi out) this way?

thanks

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ballacr75
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Re: Modulate something with envelope

Post by ballacr75 » Thu Aug 18, 2016 11:51 am

Hi, here two example files, one that produce noise (sound2ctrl connected to an amplifier) and the other with no noise (sound2ctrl connected directly to the generator). But why not create custom lfo and adsr for control purpose? with the option of keyretrig (for lfo), mono, poly, legato, and out controller destination?
Attachments
sound2ctrl-noise.sunvox
connected to amplifier
(7.3 KiB) Downloaded 43 times
sound2ctrl-no_noise.sunvox
connected to generator
(5.27 KiB) Downloaded 60 times

Koekepan
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Re: Modulate something with envelope

Post by Koekepan » Thu Aug 18, 2016 8:01 pm

init8orbit wrote: is it possible to control midi parameters (to midi out) this way?
I haven't tried it, but I don't see why not. Why not give it a try and let us know?

Koekepan
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Re: Modulate something with envelope

Post by Koekepan » Thu Aug 18, 2016 8:06 pm

ballacr75 wrote:Hi, here two example files, one that produce noise (sound2ctrl connected to an amplifier) and the other with no noise (sound2ctrl connected directly to the generator).



I played both your samples, and I didn't hear any noise, in the sense of white noise or anything like that. On the high note in both of them I heard some sharp modulation-style noise, just slightly different in one case. Which platform are you using? By the way, remember that if you try to use them polyphonically you will get cross-modulation effects going on, so you want to turn polyphony on all your generators down to 1.
ballacr75 wrote:But why not create custom lfo and adsr for control purpose? with the option of keyretrig (for lfo), mono, poly, legato, and out controller destination?
Sounds like a good idea. You should make those metamodules and upload them so that they can be included with the distribution as a community tool.

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ballacr75
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Re: Modulate something with envelope

Post by ballacr75 » Thu Aug 18, 2016 8:13 pm

I use pc with win7 64bit + soundblaster audigy 2 zs pro; it is not proper a noise like noise oscillator, it is something like an aliasing...

"Upload them..." great idea, but where I have to put them? can you give me a link for the correct page? thanks

iaon
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Re: Modulate something with envelope

Post by iaon » Thu Aug 18, 2016 10:28 pm

Don't know if this is related, but if you control the Amplifier's 'Fine Volume' instead of 'Volume' you get a gentler sound. A little Attack and Release on any of the Generators may improve things as well.

Koekepan
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Re: Modulate something with envelope

Post by Koekepan » Fri Aug 19, 2016 2:47 am

If you're going to upload metamodules, I suggest here:
viewforum.php?f=11

The aliasing that I think you're hearing is a modulation artifact. How much of an issue it is (and how soluble it is) would be up to NightRadio, I think.


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