Android MIDI IN

hseiken
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Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by hseiken » Wed Jul 18, 2018 2:04 am

ESA-kp wrote:
Mon Jul 16, 2018 7:24 pm
I know how microkernel Linux works but I cannot immagine how Android operates on this microkernel, so I don't know if it is due to Android problems or not... but is also true that other applications (I don't know how these are developped) can play midi from external USB keyboard without significant latence and any other problems.
Therefore I prefer keep open my question to NighRadio (... that he walks away from this.) :-)
I do hope he fixes these issues as well. My comment was more or less that Android seems to require extra special attention comparitively to other platforms and as a multi-platform software, it somewhat defeats the purpose of making portable code in some respects in comparison to other software which only operates on AndroidOS. So I am not suggestion he not solve the problem, I was hoping to add context to how AndroidOS doesn't make it easy to maintain such wide compatibility with so many special case scenarios.
WARNINGThis angry old nerd may rant about modern computers or computer culture! It is not directed at you 99% of the time! Ignore it if it seems silly or personal!

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NightRadio
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Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by NightRadio » Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:53 pm

There is native MIDI support in Android 6.0+. I hope to support it.
I understand that a lot of time has already passed. But usually there are some more important tasks for implementation in SunVox :)
So one day...

dcstoica
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Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by dcstoica » Tue Jul 24, 2018 8:46 am

ESA-kp wrote:
Mon Jul 16, 2018 7:24 pm
I know how microkernel Linux works but I cannot immagine how Android operates on this microkernel, so I don't know if it is due to Android problems or not... but is also true that other applications (I don't know how these are developped) can play midi from external USB keyboard without significant latence and any other problems.
Therefore I prefer keep open my question to NighRadio (... that he walks away from this.) :-)
Android by itself is a microkernel implementation of Linux!

dcstoica
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Joined: Mon Jun 17, 2013 6:36 pm

Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by dcstoica » Tue Jul 24, 2018 8:54 am

NightRadio wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:53 pm
There is native MIDI support in Android 6.0+. I hope to support it.
I understand that a lot of time has already passed. But usually there are some more important tasks for implementation in SunVox :)
So one day...
I am recording MIDI in Caustic and FL Studio Mobile perfectly on a Samsung Galaxy S (2014 build) running Android 5.0.5! With real-time audio feedback!

But I understand Alex that MIDI and VST technology is not common for a hard-core tracker! By the way I have my code that I use on top of open-source Linux sequencers/trackers to access x32/x64 VSTs written for Windows or Linux! So the work is already done!
Last edited by dcstoica on Tue Jul 24, 2018 9:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

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NightRadio
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Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by NightRadio » Tue Jul 24, 2018 9:02 am

I am recording MIDI in Caustic and FL Studio Mobile perfectly on a Samsung Galaxy S (2014 build) running Android 5.0.5! With real-time audio feedback!
Yes, there is some unofficial USB MIDI support library before OS 6.0, but i can't say how well it will interact with the native code (not Java) of SunVox.

dcstoica
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Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by dcstoica » Tue Jul 24, 2018 9:11 am

NightRadio wrote:
Tue Jul 24, 2018 9:02 am
I am recording MIDI in Caustic and FL Studio Mobile perfectly on a Samsung Galaxy S (2014 build) running Android 5.0.5! With real-time audio feedback!
Yes, there is some unofficial USB MIDI support library before OS 6.0, but i can't say how well it will interact with the native code (not Java) of SunVox.
My code is of course pure C and works pretty nice with OpenMPT cause its code has just some OO pluses - C++! ;-)

Don't tel me you've written SunVox in assembly! :-)

Not everything in Android is Java! The kernel itself is C!

For full disclosure: I know Linus and I used to be a kernel developer!

But let us get back to reality: the main use of SunVox, if I am not mistaken, is under real OSes like Window, Linux and Mac in that order of preference, so the coding for those is just a breeze since is no Java layer to get in the way of our (miss)conception!

dcstoica
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Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by dcstoica » Tue Jul 24, 2018 9:40 am

hseiken wrote:
Sun Jul 15, 2018 3:07 am
Most of those problems are with Android itself. :(
Android is a good implementation of Linux, but most of the problems come from the fact that a lot of so called developers are just dummy Java 'developers' that know only painting/coding the interface but not writing the real core/kernel/functionality of an application! It is just a way of the modern CS education! Similar to starting programming in Basic and trying to understand hard-core C code!

At least one stupid garage Basic programmer, after the IBM quarrel got smart, put some windows on the screen and then gave up programming and took over the world! Luckily his time is almost over, since now he's semi-retired like his own creation!

dcstoica
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Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by dcstoica » Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:05 am

Alex, It is quite simple: take the public MIDI specification together with your expertise of SunVox and write it native, like SunVox itself! It is much easier to write a message/signal generator/recorder on a clear specification than to understand the tweaks of some operating system and its layers of APIs!

dcstoica
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Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by dcstoica » Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:13 am

Hey, but this is music business, and I just got almost 100 GB of Ableton Live 10 sound packs in the mail and it is my duty of exploring them! :-) ;-) Mainly I will 'waste' my time with Max/MSP stuff, cause' they bought Cycling '74 and now is native in Live! The mail courier is neither US Mail nor Canada Post but just the 'humble' rutracker.org! :-))))) Since I am mainly a MIDI keyboard player another 'toy' to explore this summer is Omnisphere 2 and its STEAM extensions of Keyscape!

dcstoica
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Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by dcstoica » Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:59 am

Accessing Windows VSTs in Linux under BitWig, a nice Java application but with a native VST layer, is similar to TransVST for ProTool's AAX, but much simpler since BitWig has native Linux VST support!

hseiken
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Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by hseiken » Wed Jul 25, 2018 4:41 am

dcstoica wrote:
Tue Jul 24, 2018 9:40 am
hseiken wrote:
Sun Jul 15, 2018 3:07 am
Most of those problems are with Android itself. :(
Android is a good implementation of Linux, but most of the problems come from the fact that a lot of so called developers are just dummy Java 'developers' that know only painting/coding the interface but not writing the real core/kernel/functionality of an application! It is just a way of the modern CS education! Similar to starting programming in Basic and trying to understand hard-core C code!

At least one stupid garage Basic programmer, after the IBM quarrel got smart, put some windows on the screen and then gave up programming and took over the world! Luckily his time is almost over, since now he's semi-retired like his own creation!

I don't think Linux or Windows is better than the other. They're both hacks up on hacks upon hacks, imo.
WARNINGThis angry old nerd may rant about modern computers or computer culture! It is not directed at you 99% of the time! Ignore it if it seems silly or personal!

dcstoica
Posts: 20
Joined: Mon Jun 17, 2013 6:36 pm

Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by dcstoica » Wed Jul 25, 2018 6:40 am

hseiken wrote:
Wed Jul 25, 2018 4:41 am
dcstoica wrote:
Tue Jul 24, 2018 9:40 am
hseiken wrote:
Sun Jul 15, 2018 3:07 am
Most of those problems are with Android itself. :(
Android is a good implementation of Linux, but most of the problems come from the fact that a lot of so called developers are just dummy Java 'developers' that know only painting/coding the interface but not writing the real core/kernel/functionality of an application! It is just a way of the modern CS education! Similar to starting programming in Basic and trying to understand hard-core C code!

At least one stupid garage Basic programmer, after the IBM quarrel got smart, put some windows on the screen and then gave up programming and took over the world! Luckily his time is almost over, since now he's semi-retired like his own creation!

I don't think Linux or Windows is better than the other. They're both hacks up on hacks upon hacks, imo.
So in your view which OS, if any, is no hack and a real workhorse? Don't tel me you are a Mac user! Since I know Linux, sources and a lot of its uses I think I have a deep view on this. I build my own Linuxes based on the application domain and use of it! Windows is a mess as far as stability, security and dedicated efficiency for the task at hand! And Mac is not very faraway! With Jobs getting Berkeley UNIX in OS X, Apple come to some improvement, but lately is getting worse and worse!

The big problem with macOS is that they used the microkernel path and not kept the original BSD paradigm. Adding NextStep ideas and code made even a 'better' mess in the OS. Linux is a proven implementation of the best choices. Linus's professor Tanenbaum was proven wrong. In the real world, Google, IBM, Oracle, just to name a few, use just Linux! And Android has by far the market share over iOS or the new mobile toy from Microsoft! The essence of the story here - Linux is Open Source!

The real big players in the applications field ported to Linux for a long time. Let's take the graphics and mechanical engineering - Houdini, Maya or Siemens NX - just to name a few of the things I am playing with! On the reverse, just recently Image-Line decided to port FL Studio to the Mac! But I have to stop since I have to install NX 12 and explore its CAE and PLM improvements! ;-) :-)

https://docs.plm.automation.siemens.com ... x_whatsnew

A hack is a good thing since the term was invented at MIT in the 70'. I am a hacker and proud of it! Since I have the knowledge I could be a white, gray or black hacker, one has only to peak! To the middle of the colour spectrum I am a certified ethical/gray hacker!

I am just trying to improve your opinion with information and starting points for research in case you are interested!

hseiken
Posts: 140
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2008 3:52 am

Re: Android MIDI IN

Post by hseiken » Sun Jul 29, 2018 3:35 am

I personally think there's no need for an OS, just BIOS. OS is an unnecessary abstraction layer and the underlying 'OS' as it were should be it's own programming language and unified across a system. When you buy hardware, it should be married to it's software. Compiling as it's done now shouldn't be necessary at any point in time. There should be no such things as 'files', either. You're either running this code to look at this data or that code to look at that data. The OS is a bastardization of what makes computing actually great and a barrier for many greater things that could be done if the system itself was closer to the software instead of adding a middle man. Why do you think Gate$ got so much money? He injected a layer between the user/programmer and the hardware.

That's my point of view and eventually we'll get there.

And no, I don't use Mac and have no allegiance to anything called 'an OS' because I don't think it should exist in the first place.
WARNINGThis angry old nerd may rant about modern computers or computer culture! It is not directed at you 99% of the time! Ignore it if it seems silly or personal!

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